Darren Doherty discusses his farm setup and various broadacre topics - perennial grasses, silvopasture.

This is the fifth podcast that takes you to one of Darren's open consultancies. The consultancies themselves are workshops that center around a real world farm planning and development process. The hosts and Darren open up the process so you can learn from a real world application of theory.

This audio was recorded at Darren Doherty's Regarian Open Consultancy at Markegard Family Farm on October 22 and 23, 2013. The workshop was open source, so thanks to Darren for allowing me to share this with you all.

This is the full presentation from one of Greg Judy's talks from PV1.

Greg and his wife Jan are farmers from Rucker, Missouri. On their farm, Green Pastures Farm, they raise cattle, sheep, horses, goats, pigs, and chickens on grass pasture in balance with nature. They don't use any antibiotics, no hormone implants, and no grain. The livestock graze rich pasture 100% of their lives.

They use rotational grazing on their farm, which means they are constantly moving the livestock to fresh rested pasture to graze and let the previous grazed pasture rest so that it can grow back undisturbed. Their pastures are rich in clovers and many species of natural grasses. They don't use any chemical fertilizers or herbicides on any of the pastures. Large populations of birds, ants, worms, butterflies, spiders & bees build soil and control pests.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/45

Chad Sentman of Action House Productions joins me to about video, permaculture, and business. Chad is the videographer that filmed PV1. He is also an permie entrepreneur who started his own video production company. Now he is using those skills to get more involved in permaculture.

In the podcast we talk about the idea of permaculture looking at itself more holistically - getting more people from other fields involved in permaculture. Lawyers, financiers, real estate agents, etc. - not just permaculture designers and agriculture related fields.

Chad will talk about filming video and give you some tips on producing good video.

And we will finish up the podcast talking business.

"Instead of focusing on why something isn't possible, focusing how you can make it happen."

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/44

Shannon Jones, a young farmer from River Hebert, Nova Scotia joins me to talk about what it is like to be a young farmer on her farm, Broadfork Farm. She started the farm with her partner Bryan Dyck in 2011.

Both Shannon and Bryan farmed on other farms for many years before they started their own farm. The lived simply and knew what they could get by without. That made the transition to farming a lot easier. Their path of frugality is one path into farming. But like Shannon said, find what works for you and don't just copy what someone else did.

At the end of the day it is very clear that Shannon loves what she does. Living her dream, working her dream job, as part of the next generation of farmers.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/43

Michael Jordan, The Bee Whisperer, joins me to talk about bees and bee keeping.

Michael is a holistic bee keeper who is doing beekeeping the right way. He has worked tirelessly to promote sustainable bee keeping, that respects, not exploits the bees, and gets the youth involved. You can find out more about Michael via A Bee Friendly Company.

I tried to keep this episode on the positive side. How can we work beneficially with bees in a way that is sustainable? There is so much talk out there about bad bee practices, I really wanted to try to focus on the positive side of things, instead of just talking about the problems that are out there. BEEcause the way I see it if did things the right way in the first place then we wouldn't be having all of these problems with the bees.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/42

John Pugliano of Investable Wealth joins me to talk about navigating the fear of leaving one job and starting a fresh career.

One key theme that I hear from a lot of people is that they want to transition from their job doing X into doing Y (something related to permaculture). But that desire to make the transition is often overshadowed by fear, fear of the the unknown.

Common fears include:
How can I afford my mortgage, insurance, food for my kids, etc.
What if my business fails. I will be financially ruined.
I have too much debt, so I can't afford to quit my job.

These are some of the many reasons that John and I have heard from people when it comes from giving up income 'certainty' for the unknown income volatility that comes with being self employed. These reasons, may or may not be justified. Often times these are just quick excuses that someone comes up with for why they really don't want to do do what they say they are going to do.

That's all totally fine. Follow your own path But if things really seem scary, then take some time to run the numbers, ask the tough questions, and figure out a way to de-risk things. Maybe it really isn't as bad as you first thought..

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/41

Ben Falk and Grant Schultz join me to talk about permaculture as a survival preparedness strategy. How can we use whole systems design to create systems that work passively to increase our resiliency. In our modern day world we are quick to throw money at technological, mechanical systems that are complicated and brittle. In an emergency situation you could have a generator, but if that breaks or you run out of fuel, you are out of luck. If you have a wood fuel based system, it is going to work no matter what, it's bulletproof.

Ben and Grant are both a wealth of knowledge when it comes to homestead technology, both simple and complex. They are living the lifestyle. Using and building the systems that they talk about. They are both builders and tinkerers, therefor they understand how these systems work, and can break down. You will learn how important it is to buy high quality tool that will last a lifetime (and the tools to service the tools); often times those tools were built 80 years ago and can be bought on the cheap. They have an appreciation for good quality tools and things you can craft by hand. Simple is beautiful, simple is resilient.

This isn't typical prepper talk of buying generators, storing fuel, and MREs. This is all about designing systems that will work before and after SHTF.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/40

Mark Shepard of Forest Agriculture Enterprises joins me to talk about the future of agriculture.

Mark has a pretty clear view on how he thinks the future of agriculture could be.. restoration agriculture style farms dotting the landscape with animals roaming through grasslands dappled with trees, a perennial polyculture system that builds soil instead of destroying it, a system that sequesters carbon instead of volatilizing it, a system that utilizes all of the water that falls on a piece of land, a system restores the land, and importantly a system provides nutrient dense food on scale - bulk calories and makes money doing it allowing a farmer to earn a decent living in the process. These systems could restore the land and rural America. I think it is totally possible, and when you hear Mark speak I think you will feel the same way. This is the future of agriculture.

This is probably one of those episodes that you will need to listen to a few times to get every little juicy nugget out of it. Whether you want to farm broadacre or not, this episode is busting at the seems with knowledge and wisdom.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/39

Bob Hamberg of Omega-Alpha Recycling Systems and Dragon Husbandry joins me to talk about anaerobic digestion and biogas. How we can use "waste" to close the loop and get beneficial by-products in the process. The anaerobic digesters can be integrated into permaculture and homestead systems by incorporating them within greenhouses and tying them into pond systems.

As for "waste disposal," we've got two mis-defined terms resulting in an abominable oxymoron. In nature there is no such thing as waste. All residues serve as resources for further growth - there is nothing to be disposed of. Nothing is thrown away. Indeed, there is no "away". Everything must go somewhere. The misconception of waste disposal must be superseded by the concept of residue management.

Show Notes:  www.permaculturevoices.com/38

I am talking to my friend Tall Paul who helped out at registration with PV1.

In this episode we talk about why I did what I did when I planned out the conference and what my goals are for the future.

Specific issues we touch on include:

Why weren't there more women speakers?

Why the heck was it at a casino?

Why was it so expensive?

What is a professional permaculture confernece?

I talk about all of these issues and where the conference is headed.

We have already started planning for PV2 which will be held in San Diego, CA in March 2015.

Toby Hemenway joins me to talk permaculture - how permaculture has changed and how we can work more permaculture into our lives.

Toby also talks about being one of instructors for the new Ecological Landscaper Immersion Program that is being put on by the Erik Ohlsen and the Permaculture Skills Center.

Key Takeaways

It really benefits anyone in almost any field to be able to think in whole systems. Someone who embraces permaculture can do a lot more than teach and design property. Apply permaculture techniques and principles to what you do.

Find good mentors. Many people want to help others. You just have to ask.

Some standard economic training is good. You can get a great toolkit and then apply it however you want. Standard training is a tool, a means to an end if you goal is ecological design.

Catch kids while thinking in whole systems. Before they are trained out of it into compartmentalized thinking.

Starting with soil fertility and building organic matter is a good idea. It is almost a universal panacea along with being careful with water.

Move to the highest generalization. For example, do you want to open a store, or do you want to make a living providing good products for your community.

Find the things in life that you are really good at and do those things. It gives you good feedback and then you start building confidence and making forward progress.

Want to transition careers? Find ways to make it less scary - lower expenses.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/37

Darren Doherty discusses soil mineralization, value adding on farms, and farm water systems.

This is the fourth podcast that takes you to one of Darren's open consultancies. The consultancies themselves are workshops that center around a real world farm planning and development process. The hosts and Darren open up the process so you can learn from a real world application of theory.

This audio was recorded at Darren Doherty's Regarian Open Consultancy at Markegard Family Farm on October 22 and 23, 2013. The workshop was open source, so thanks to Darren for allowing me to share this with you all.

Darren Doherty walks Doniga and Eric Markegard through some basic farm design. Working with contour maps. Where to hold water in the landscape. Various uses for tree systems on the farm.

This is the third podcast that takes you to one of Darren's open consultancies. The consultancies themselves are workshops that center around a real world farm planning and development process. The hosts and Darren open up the process so you can learn from a real world application of theory.

This audio was recorded at Darren Doherty's Regarian Open Consultancy at Markegard Family Farm on October 22 and 23, 2013. The workshop was open source, so thanks to Darren for allowing me to share this with you all.

Dave Whitinger of All Things Plants joins me for a to chat about different [permaculture] plants that he grows.

Most of these plants are class permaculture plants. They are plants that perform multiple functions within a system. Many of these are sadly considered weeds - comfrey, lambs quarter, dandelion, yarrow, mint, and more.

Dave talks about his experiences with each of the plants, what functions they perform, and some of the ways that he is using the plants in hi system.

Dave also talks about potato growing and how he uses plants to feed his chickens in a paddock shift system on his Texas homesite.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/b007

Kevin Muno is on the show talking about his new start-up restoration agriculture style farm, Montado Farms.

Kevin talks about why he is doing what he is doing against a lot of heavy odds - highland prices, limited water in Southern California, and he doesn't come from a farming background. He touches on all of the big issues like how do you fund a $1M farm as start-up.

Kevin is approaching the farm as a business and we address everything that goes along with that - the farm business structure, raising capital, and cash flows.

If you don't think anyone besides Mark Shepard is farming these types of systems, you are mistaken. These systems are starting to come on line and Kevin is one of the ones leading the ay.

There are a hundred reasons that you could give Kevin on why he shouldn’t do what he is doing and why it might not work. But, I don’t think he cares about why it can’t be done, because he is focusing on getting it done. That’s what makes his story different. He doesn’t have that farming background that you would expect him to have, but he has the drive and determination to leverage the skills that he has to figure out a way to make his dream happen.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/36

Rob Avis of Verge Permaculture joins me to talk about the business of permaculture - a right livelihood.

We live in a world where we are surrounded by environmental liabilities that have a real economic impact. So why not solve those problems and earn a living in the process?

Rob talks a lot about approaching permaculture as a profession. What opportunities are out there. What works in permaculture based business and what doesn't. And how we in the permaculture community should embrace business, charge an appropriate price for our services while we solve the world's problems.

This episode should dismiss the myth of the pauper and permaculture. There are legitimate large scale problems that need to be solved. And permaculture provides a matrix of solutions to solve those problems. There are a huge number of business opportunities out there do what you love to do, earn a living, and make a better world. The hardest part? Just getting started.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/35

Grant Schultz joins me to talk about developing a perennial polyculture in the middle of row-crop corn and soy country Iowa.

He discusses a lot of the innovation and developments taking place on his farm, including some really innovative ways of doing GPS keyline design.

We spend a lot of time talking about the business of farming. The importance of monitoring cash flows and being cash flow positive. And how Grant is using USDA funds to help pay for pieces of his system and getting moving in the right direction.

Key Takeaways:

Importance of making your operation cashflow the whole time. Expenses will pile up so start getting cashflow and a customer base early.

Consider buying rootstock and graft it over later. It is much cheaper to go that route and grafting isn't that hard.

Get plant systems going early on. It is fairly inexpensive and gets the system starting to advance.

Have a plan but evolve as you go. Having an end in mind gives you a goal and a direction to head in, but things will change along the way as you learn the intricacies of the system.

Plant the earliest maturing fruit trees downslope. That way when you are browsing them the manure runs downhill.

How do you want your system to look at maturity and what are the action items to get you there? Then the thing to do is the one with the most impact. What has the earliest yield to get you to the move to the next impact item.

Do not underestimate the importance of monitoring and planing out cashflows.

When you are farming on broad acres you have the same advantages that conventional farmers have. Crop insurance.

Consider using a nurse crop that also cash flows. Grant's example of raising oats for cover crop seed.

Consider the balance of high value versus high labor. Is the value worth the labor?

There is a huge need for more local genetic permaculture plant material.

Recognize the importance of planting dense. Buy trees in mass. It gets cheap and doesn't cost you more to plant at high density. You take advantage of genetic selection and protect yourself against losses.

Irrigate your trees if possible - think keyline, swales. Growth rates of trees that are irrigated versus those that aren't is huge when the trees have consistent water availability. Consider the economic impact of the yield with water versus no water. The work now can make you a lot more money down the line.

Take advantage of all available resources: USDA, NRCS, EQIP. When starting out pre-sell as much as you can. Build a local customer base from Day 1.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/34

Patricia Foreman the author of City Chicks joins me to talk about backyard chickens, chicken tractors, and general chickenery.

We will talk about all of the great things that chickens can add to a permaculture homestead - fertilizer, pest management, food, disturbance, baby sitters.  :)

Pat will touch on soil building using chickens in composting systems and chickens tractors.  And how chickens can be used to close the loop on our waste stream... and in some case even save tax payers money.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/33

Darren Doherty walks Doniga and Eric Markegard through the Holistic Design process.

This is the second podcast that takes you to one of Darren's open consultancies. The consultancies themselves are workshops that center around a real world farm planning and development process. The hosts and Darren open up the process so you can learn from a real world application of theory.

This audio was recorded at Darren Doherty's Regarian Open Consultancy at Markegard Family Farm on October 22 and 23, 2013. The workshop was open source, so thanks to Darren for allowing me to share this with you all.

Javan Bernakevitch of Permaculture BC joins me today to talk about finding your niche in permaculture.

Javan will take you through some of the insight he has for finding your niche.

Javan is a permaculture teacher and designer who has worked with countless students helping them sift through the everything that is permaculture to help them figure out what really fires them up, and what’s just OK.

If you want to turn permaculture, or anything, into a career, just having the knowledge isn’t enough. You need to really think about where you fit into it all. Where do you want to go and what will give you a the fulfilled life you want? One key piece of figuring that out is discovering where opportunity and your passion overlap.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/32

Geoff Lawton joins me today to talk about permaculture. Geoff talks about his early days in permaculture, where we are in permaculture today, and where we need to go in the future. He touches on what he has learned along the way and what he finds most valuable.

Geoff then goes on to answer a lot of audience questions about tree systems, water harvesting, his new chicken tractor for composting, and his upcoming online PDC.

Key Takeaways:

Consider starting a community group. They provide a whole lot of support to keep things moving in the right direction.

Realize the ability of pioneer plants and succession to work for you. One of Geoff's early mistakes was not allowing plants to work more for him. Later he embraced and accepted plant rampancy.

Don't just do things in patterns for the sake of patterns. Rationalize and legitimize every placement and connection you make.

So many people are stuck in the matrix. They know things, they just don't do anything.

Permaculture needs to focus on feeding people in urban and peri-urban areas.

Use chickens in your composting system. There is a huge benefit to using chickens at the beginning of a composting cycle.

Consider aquaculture as a use for wetlands in temperate wetlands. Whatever you dig in wetlands you gain in soil, so you intensify the water. You get drier land and wetter water using a temperate climate chinampa.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/31

Paul Wheaton of permies.com joins me to talk about intentional community. Paul discusses his views and experiences with variety of different intentional communities that he has been a part of, both on the leader side, and the follower side. He talks about what works, and what doesn't.

Paul also touches on some of the projects taking place within his community on his land and how we need to help increase the velocity of permaculture.

And we discuss Paul's latest Kickstarter for his Permaculture Earthworks DVD.

Key Takeaways:

-Possibly consider the central leader model over consensus. Consensus can take a lot of time and stall projects to resolve conflicts.

-There are a lot of advantages to having fiefdoms overlaying each other on the same piece of land where each fiefdom is inadvertently helping the other fiefdoms.

-Focus on the audience that get it and stop worrying about focusing on everyone else. Focus on the 1 person out of 20,000 that gets it.

-Embrace a lot of failure as part of the process to move forward. It takes a lot of trial and error to ultimately achieve success.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/30

Darren Doherty presents the regrarian platform. This is Darren's introductory presentation that he gave an open consultancy in October 2013. The presentation lays out the ten key components of the regarian platform - climate, geography, water, access, forestry, buildings, fences, soils, marketing, and energy.

This is the first podcast that takes you to one of Darren's open consultancies. The consultancies themselves are workshops that center around a real world farm planning and development process. The hosts and Darren open up the process so you can learn from a real world application of theory.

This audio was recorded at Darren Doherty's Regarian Open Consultancy at Markegard Family Farm on October 22 and 23, 2013. The workshop was open source, so thanks to Darren for allowing me to share this with you all.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/29

Will Harris III from White Oak Pastures joins me to talk about his inspirational journey of converting his one time factory farm to a beyond organic farming operation that celebrates polyculture and closes the loop on wastes.

Will runs the largest USDA organic farm in Georgia farming 1200 owned acres and 2000 leased. He has over 2000 head of cattle and raises 60,000 pastured chickens. He has built two abattoirs on site - one for red meat, one for poultry. He has an organic vegetable CSA and heirloom orchard.

His farm closes the loop on sustainability through rotational grazing, solar power, and the recycling of all of his various "wastes" from his animal operations. All of the wash water, bones, and other animal "wastes" end up back on the land, building the soil over time.

But it wasn't always that way. Prior to 1995 White Oak Pastures raised cattle in an industrial system, a monoculture. Then Will made the decision to change what he was doing. So began the conversion over the beyond organic, mulch-species thriving farming operation that it is today.

Will's story in an inspiration, and another example of what is right in modern day agriculture.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/28

Ben Falk from Whole Systems Design, LLC joins me talk about permaculture design and what he has learned on his research site over the years.

He talks about how to break into the business as a designHe touches on cold climate infrastructure and heating with wood. And he goes into his thoughts on designing a property and why it's important to understand the land's capability and how you should relate that to your goals.

We also spend some time talking about the mass selection of plant genetics for a site, stressing the importance of over stacking the system in the beginning to see what works and what doesn't.

Key Takeaways:

Get some experience working with the land and systems before you start designing properties as "a designer."

You can reduce your wood usage by 30-40% by drying wood well versus haphazardly drying it.

Cold humid climates have a low tolerance for bad moisture detailing in structures. When designing a home detail carefully to keep the home dry and get water out.

Grow tree multi-purpose tree species for fuel wood. Consider black locusts - fixes nitrogen, fast grower, rot resistant wood, good fuel wood, and makes great saw logs.

Have goals but understand the land's capability so you can adjust those goals as needed. Don't fight against the land's tendencies and capabilities, work with it, not against it.

Most people have more land than they can manage well. Moving down in acreage might be advantageous. It is better to manage 5 acres right than 100 acres wrong.

Most people can have most of their needs met on 5-10 acres. Unless you have a commercial aspect or grazing component.

Have a good access plan for your site. Don't box yourself out. Start and maintain a clear access pattern which is based on the water flow throughout the site.

For site selection general location and access are a quick way to filter down a list of a lot of properties. Then look to the Keyline Scale of Permanance. Consider water security and controlling as much of a watershed as you can.

Focus on manageability with regards to plantings. Plant based on water access with on contour swales.

Not all permaculture techniques will work on all sites. So don't expect that.

Practice the mass selection of genetics. Identify the best genetics from your site by growing trees from seed. Plant as many tress as you can on a site, way closer than you would ever imagine, and cut out the ones that don't do well.

Use the first 3-5 years on a site to learn what does well. Years 5-10 are when you focus on plants and families that really want ot grow on your site - microclimate - aspect - soils. And there is no way to know which ones will work unless you start putting a lot of plants in the ground.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/27

Curtis Stone of Green City Acres joins me to talk about his experience as a SPIN Farmer.

SPIN Farming is a methodology to grown a lot of produce on very little land. It provides you with a plan to get started now so you can get cash flow going, gain experience and skills. It breaks down the big barriers to farming, being owning land the access to capital. SPIN teaches you how to start farming with very little start-up cost and how to get a quick return on your investment.Typical start-up costs are around $10,000 and you can make $20,000 in your first year.

When Curtis started SPIN Farming he put $7000 into the business and made $22000 his first year. His main start-up costs included a rototiller, a walk in cooler, garden tools, and his irrigation supplies. Every year since they Curtis has grown his business and his earnings.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/26

John Kitsteiner of Temperate Climate Permaculture joins me to discuss his series of blog posts, The Myth of the Perfect Job.

So many of us are stuck in the rat race. We want to be farmers, homesteaders, or something else that involves working closer to home, and not for the man. But we never end up doing that. Why? I think people are either afraid to take a risk and start, or they don't know where to start.

This podcast should start to address both of those issues and at least get you thinking.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

Be careful of the danger of just pursuing your passion. At the end of the day you have to make a living and get some sort of yield for your work.

Balance: Biological, physical, social, spiritual health. Most people focus on one or two areas, not all. Consider this when pursuing a career path.

Start looking for a career where your passion and skills overlap. Then start adding in what does the world need (will they pay for it) and does it have meaning to your own life.

Think about if a new career is sustainable. Could you do it every day all day for the next 1, 2, 5, 10 years? Along with all of the side baggage that goes with it - accounting, marketing, legal, etc..

A lot of marketing is driven to you to consume more stuff. Often times that consumption is fueled by debt and is filling a void to pursue happiness.

Forcing kids into careers. How many people were "forced" down a career path by parents, counselors, and teachers because it "was a good career path." And the you could parlay that career into a life of "success with a big house, nice car, and a whole bunch of bills.

Embrace the idea of having a few primary careers, and multiple secondary careers. That creates resiliency and helps to eliminate boredom and burnout. Permie examples - think: Paul Wheaton, Joel Salatin, Darren Doherty, Rob Avis.

Permaculture Principle 10: Use and value diversity. "Diversity reduces vulnerability to a variety of threats and takes advantage of the unique nature of the environment in which is resides." [permacultureprinciples.com] Apply this thought to careers and finances. Embrace the diversity to meet your needs and become more resilient.

Money is the excuse, but fear it the reality. It doesn't take a lot to get our needs met. But it takes courage to step away from the rat race.

Show Notes: permaculturevoices.com/25

Owen Hablutzel joins me to talk about patterns in permaculture and the power of setting a goal.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

Patterns are the shorthand of nature. They take a large complex system of forces and processes and simplifies it down.

What is the long term vision of the project? A lot of designs fall apart on the social impact side of the project.

Take the time to set and write down a goal. That process greatly increases the likelihood that something will happen in the direction of your goal.

Think about setting a Holistic Goal.

"If you can understand patterns and what causes them to become the way they are, you can tell an awful lot about the processes that created it. And if you understand that, then you can create a design pattern that is going to best work with those forces."

"Begin with the end in mind."

"Without a goal it's tough to know exactly what you are designing for."

"If it's not written down then it is not likely to happen, or much less likely to happen."

"Don't buy the suit to match the tie."

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/24

This is replay of the webinar that was recorded on December 5, 2013 with Rebecca Krassnoski. Attendees submitted their questions about raising hogs and Rebecca answered them.

the b reels: episodes of the Permaculture Voices podcast that just weren't a fit for the main weekly show. This is content that I have that is worth sharing, but it will be a little more raw, unedited, and no show notes. The b reels can come out at anytime, while the main weekly interview based version of the podcast will always come out on Friday.

These episodes are part experiment, so hopefully they give you as the listener some valuable information. Especially for the listener who just can't get enough permaculture in their life. Enjoy the show, and go out and be a part of the positive change.

And let me know what you think, I would love to hear from you. Thanks for listening and thanks for support us, and permaculture.

www.permaculturevoices.com

Joey Delia of Tipuana Farm joins me to talk about overstory trees in permaculture systems.

We touch on species of overstory trees that grow in our area and the benefits of those trees to a system. Dealing with too much shade. Finding fast growing species and other thoughts that we have on the subject.

the b reels: episodes of the Permaculture Voices podcast that just weren't a fit for the main weekly show. This is content that I have that is worth sharing, but it will be a little more raw, unedited, and no show notes. The b reels can come out at anytime, while the main weekly interview based version of the podcast will always come out on Friday.

These episodes are part experiment, so hopefully they give you as the listener some valuable information. Especially for the listener who just can't get enough permaculture in their life. Enjoy the show, and go out and be a part of the positive change.

And let me know what you think, I would love to hear from you. Thanks for listening and thanks for support us, and permaculture.

www.permaculturevoices.com

Michael Pollan joins me to talk about GMOs, organic food, the industrial agriculture, and his new book Cooked.

Points we hit on:

What will it take to ultimately get GMOs labelled in the US? And what affect will that labeling have.

Rewarding farmers for embracing sustainable practices.

Getting changes in agriculture from the grassroots, corporate and government level.

Getting representation for eaters on the government agriculture committees which are currently dominated by lightly populated corn belt states.

The importance of being able to demonstrate scientifically that we can do what we say we can do - relating to permaculture, sustainable agriculture.

The importance of cooking your own food and the trickle down effects. If you are cooking your own food then you have the ability to shop from local farmers, farmers markets, and CSAs. Fast food supports industrial agriculture.

10% of the food dollar goes to the farmer. The longer the food chain the less the farmer gets. Even the packaging manufacturers make more than the farmers.

By diversifying as a farmer and having more than a single crop you are able to being more of a price maker than a price taker in the commodity system.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/23

Joey Delia of EvokeHope.org joins me to recap the recent Darren Doherty Regrarian Open Consultancy, talk about the Dehesa system of Spain, and an upcoming PDC at the new PRI Tipuana Farm.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

Don't focus on tactics. Slow down, observe and embrace a more passive approach to permaculture.

Plant trees in the eroded gullies. Helps to control erosion while providing a valuable timber crop.

Use roads as catchment. Often times roads are permitable, water harvesting is not. Roads have a lot of surface area to harvest water.  Use it to your advantage.

Offset other systems off of the roads. This helps to create some order for systems like waterlines. If it is buried 5 feet off of the road then it will always be 5 feet off of the road.

Consider using HDPE line instead of PVC. The fact that it is flexible might make things a lot easier. And it is probably a lot less toxic.

Embrace the thistle, it is amazing.

Read about the Dehesa system as a perennial ecosystem. So simple, yet so interconnected and productive.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/22

Stefan Sebkowiak of Miracle Farms joins me to talk about the what's lacking in organic systems - biodiversity. And why organic is good, but creating a polyculture is a lot better.

Stefan started out his journey purchasing a conventional non-organic orchard. He worked on converting it over to organic and realized that something wasn't right, something was missing. The system was lacking the biodiversity that you see in nature.

So Stefan converted over his organic orchard into a permaculture, polyculture based system. He removed a lot of apple trees and replaced them with other fruit trees and support species. He added more diversity to the system giving him more products to sell, more wildlife, and ultimate a healthier, more resilient system.

A lot of commercial orchardists say that polyculture won't work. Stefan has show that on a tree by tree basis he is getting as much yield as a conventional orchard.

He is out there trying to prove that you gross $1.00 per square foot in a polyculture system that value adds from multiple yields - poultry, fruit, vegetables, herbs, etc.

"You can read a lot, but you need to go out and test things."

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/21

David Barmon of Fiddlehead Landscape Design joins me to talk about urban lumber. We discuss how we can start thinking about urban trees as not just a source of beauty, but as a valuable, sustainable resource.

Most people don't really think about what happens to a tree in an urban setting. Most of the time it ends up as fireword, mulch, or goes to the landfill.

David thinks that we could be sourcing 10-20% of our lumber from urban sources. This creates a lot of value for landowners, both private and public, in addition to adding all of the other benefits that trees bring to a landscape.

Creating valuable lumber from urban trees sequesters carbon while providing a renewable resource.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/20

Joel talks a lot about how young people can get into farming by establishing synergistic relationships with older farmers as he tries to dispel the big belief that you need land to farm.

He touches on the farming business and how conventional farmers can start to transition to a perennial based agricultural system.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

Convert a little bit of acres at a time, when converting a large amount of land from an annual based system to a perennial based system.

Converting a corn, soybean operation over to grassfed beef. It would take a year to plant the grass, an d it would take another year to come into production. You could start grazing it the second year and 3 years out you would be making more money per acre than you would on corn and beans.

Possibly sell some land to get yourself enough wiggle room to convert your farm over to a more regenerative agriculture system.

Prune off enterprises that don't work. Maybe you can't figure them out. It doesn't fit your marketbase or your unfair advantage. Each enterprise has to carry its own weight.

Beware of the enslavement of highly capitalized infrastructure. Too often that infrastructure controls the decision making process for right or wrong due to the amount of money invested into it.

Use in place infrastructure to help transition to a perennial polyculture. That equipment is already in place. Make use of it.

Take the Stephen Covey approach. Control your own sphere of influence.

This episode of the podcast is the audio from an interview that I did with Joel Salatin of Polyface Farm back on May 22, 2013 in Big Bear Lake, CA.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/19

What do you do with 350,000 gallons of rainwater runoff that enters your property with a high velocity causing erosion?

One option is to harvest that water, slow it down, and take away the erosion by constructing some permaculture earthworks.

Alden Hough of the Sky Mountain Institute joins me to talk about some earthworks that were constructed on his 7 acre property last March during a Paul Wheaton earthworks workshop.He will also talk about some of the upcoming events at the 2013 Fall San Diego Permaculture Convergence that will expand these earthworks.

Joey Delia of Evoke Hope and Tipuana Farm also joins the conversation to talk about the plant systems that were put in place after the earthworks construction.

During the workshop last March we constructed a pond and a long swale to capture the 350,000 gallons of storm water that were running off of the road onto Alden's property, causing a lot of erosion in the process.

The dam was constructed at the highest part of the property allowing Alden to gravity feed the water down-slope and zig zag the water across and down the property through a series of swales decreasing its erosive qualities and hydrating the landscape in the process.

The earthworks have turned the problem (high velocity, high volume water) into a solution; providing water to grow native habit and food in a winter rainfall area, where water isn't cheap.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/18

Rebecca Krossnoski of Nature Delivered Farm joins me to talk about her passion for pigs. Rebecca left her job as a construction estimator 6 years ago to start pasture raising pigs. She realized that her old job wasn't going to be there forever so she began the transition into the farming business while she was still working at her old job. She had no prior farming experience when she embarked on the venture, learning along the way from her grandfather's notes, other farmers, and books, then building on that book knowledge with real world trial and error.

Rebecca is another example of someone who decided to follow her passion and make a go of farming with no prior farming experience. She could have easily made excuses about why it wouldn't work or what her disadvantages were, but she didn't focus on that, she focused on the positive and made it happen. She put her heart and soul into her pigs, did her research, and worked her ass off. Like any new business there were some troubles and mistakes made along the way, but in the end she was successful.

Today Rebecca pasture raises her pigs in central Florida. She rotates pigs through 1/2 to 1 1/2 acre parcels. The pigs spend 3 to 4 weeks in each parcel.

Rebecca's advice for anyone who interested in raising pigs. Start with a couple of barrows (a castrated male before puberty) and raise them. See how you like living with pigs. Then process the pigs, and see if you can actually do it. After this you should know if pigs are for you.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/17

Darren Doherty of Heenan Doherty and Regrarians joins me from Australia to fill in some of the gaps surrounding Keyline design.

While the whole Keyline design system is complex and way beyond the scope of this podcast.This episode should give you a brief introduction into what Keyline is, where it can be used, and what it can accomplish. Like all other design systems Keyline isn't the be all, end all, it is another tool in the tool box help design a regenerative landscape.

For those that want to learn more check out Darren's work, some of it below, and P.A. Yeomans books. Darren recommends The Keyline Plan and The Challenge of Landscape.

Keyline design is a foundation of technique and planning using a scale of permanence. It's focus is on reacting to a climate of an environment, a site, and then using the landscape's shape to maximize the possibility of a sustainable, regenerative environment.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/16

Joel Salatin of Polyface Farm joins me to talk about his new book Fields of Farmers which focuses on the next generation of farmers.How young people can work with existing farmers to transition into farming. He talks about young people can do today to take advantage of the huge opportunity that is out there. Topics range from leasing land to forming synergistic, non-competitive enterprises on existing farms. The whole key is that you have to start. Movement creates movement.

Joel touches on the cultural stereotype against farming. So many people get "forced" into a job that they hate to satisfy their parents only to do that career for a few years and realize that they hate it.All along that person only wanted to do something with their hands. So why not encourage the youth to follow those passions and pursue them with all of their skills and talents.

This episode also has a very heavy entrepreneurial component. Hopefully it will motivate some people to get out there, stop thinking about farming, and actually start farming.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

Invest in hydration. Get water into the landscape.

You don't have to own land to farm. Look for land to lease. Look to add another enterprise onto an existing farm. Focus on mobile infrastructure.

Insource carbon instead of outsource carbon. So many farmers start out bringing in fertilizer at the beginning.Start building up your soils at the beginning to lower your long term input costs.

Grow what you like to eat. You may have to eat through your inventory.

Be willing to do whatever it takes to make it work. That might mean putting in a lot of hours, making a lot of sacrifices, cutting expenses, and taking some odds jobs.

Make use of what you have first. Don't buy anything. So many people want to run out and buy things when they first start out. Access what you have, use that, and only buy what you absolutely need.

Better to become 80% self reliant that get analysis paralysis and not doing anything while trying to become 100% self reliant.

Doing something is better than doing nothing.

Stack multiple enterprises on a single land base whenever possible.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/15

John Backes of Circle B Ranch joins me to talk about raising pastured hogs on 90 acres in Missouri. John didn't come from a farming background. He transitioned into farming in 2009 with his wife Marina after leaving a career in mechanical contracting. They set out to produce high quality food while focusing on the welfare and humane treatment of their hogs.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

-Be steadfast with pricing. Stay away from brokers, sale barns, and commodity pricing.-Stresses the importance of educating and connecting with the customer base. That involves a lot of marketing your own product through tools like social media.

-Pick a spouse that is a good compliment to your skills as a farm. It’s a team effort.

-Stress affects meat quality. So try to minimize the animal’s stress.

-Maintain good relationships with the hogs. Keep them calm because ultimately they are big and you want them working with you.

Visit www.permaculturevoices.com/14 for show notes.

Darren Doherty of Heenan Doherty and Regrarians joins me from Australia to talk about the regrarian philosophy that he has put together and how it can be used to regenerate landscapes and farming enterprises.

This is a system that borrows and includes tools from multiple disciplines like permaculture, keyline design, the transition movement, carbon farming, and the work of of people like Joel Salatin, Paul Stamets, and Dr. Elaine Ingham. These tools give you the ability to design a system that ultimately regenerates land while producing numerous agricultural products. The system deals with everything from the work done on the land to how you can synergistically stack multiple enterprises in the same system, and ultimately how to market and distribute those products to the people that actually want them. The system emphasizes participating in all 4 legs of the farm income stool - production, processing, marketing, and distribution. This allows you to be a market price setter, not a price receiver.

If you are involved in an agricultural enterprise, or if you want to be involved in an agricultural enterprise, then you need to pay attention to the regrarian system and learn this information. The current status quo of agriculture isn't working; it isn't sustainable, it's degenerative. The regarian system IS regenerative. And it gives you the tools to produce the products that the consumers ultimately want, all while living the farming lifestyle that you want to live. It won't be easy, and it will be hard work, but hey that's farming. And I think farmers that farm in systems like this have fun and enjoy their life because they can make good living while restoring the land.

Show Notes: www.permaculturevoices.com/13

Doniga Markegard of Markegard Family Grass-Fed comes on the show to talk about ranching, permaculture, and the regenerative power of rotational livestock grazing.She is a real life rancher, who is out there successfully doing things the right way. On her ranch she is using cattle, sheep, and pigs to build the soil and supply the San Fransisco Bay area with high quality food.Doniga discusses why traditional ranching methods often fail and lead to degenerative cycles with the soil; and how a more holistic, permaculture approach can actually repair landscapes. She talks about how they use permaculture on their ranch to increase species diversity and to increase the water holding capacity of the soil. She touches on how to get into ranching, the advantages of small herd dairy, and the importance of leasing land.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

-The healing power of using proper livestock rotational management on a landscape is tremendous. Doniga often sees the benefits after just one or two rotations. The disturbance created by the livestock starts to build organic matter in the soil, sequester carbon, increase water infiltration, and that then leads to increased species diversity.
-The big impact of stock ponds. Early keypoint dams have played a huge role in the health of their farm. Water is kept on site, instead of running off site, causing erosion. Retaining this water has helped to rehydrate the landscape.
-Don't be afraid to lease land. Land is prohibitively expensive in California, so leasing is a good option for ranching. It will require some work, but a lot of land is available.

Visit www.permaculturevoices.com/12 for show notes.

What if you could gross $100,000 per acre in a small sustainable agriculture operation? You could make a good living and/or you could afford to pay someone a decent wage. If you can gross roughly $2.50 per square foot, per year, then that translates into a gross revenue of $100,000 per acre, per year. How can permaculture techniques be used to accomplish that goal?

Chris Young of SoCal Shrooms and Closing the Loop joins me to talk about just that. His goal is to show that you can gross that $100k so you can hire one person to work an acre of land and pay them a good wage to work it. He aims to achieve this by reducing input costs and stacking revenue generators, all while improving the quality of the land and producing a high quality product.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:

-Oyster mushrooms have a nice advantage of having a quick turn around. They can start creating cash-flow in 4 to 6 weeks. Similar to selling sprouts and micro-greens which have a 2 to 3 week turnaround.

-If possible tap into an existing distribution network. This gets you contacts right out of the gate.

-Get more out of the same amount of land. Property taxes will go up the future, water costs will go up in the future, and more and more land is being developed away from farmland. So try to be more productive on the same amount of land while improving the quality of that land.

-Consider the cost of your own time in the business. And pay yourself.

-You have to do the real numbers for you business.Don't fudge them. The numbers won't lie. If something isn't working, then look at the numbers and see where you can start making changes to make the numbers work. When you have exhausted all possibilities, then it is time to move on.

-Start broad and control your risk at the beginning. Then look at the numbers and refine down overtime to optimize each system or business.

-Celebrate the small victories. There is a lot of drudgery that goes along with business and farming, so enjoy the good times.

Show Notes: permaculturevoices.com/11

Cathy Payne of Broad River Pastures joins me to talk about heritage breed livestock and her journey into farming that began in her mid-50's.

Cathy and her husband started changing their diet in their 50's. Their quest for nutrient dense food led them to local farmers, and a lot of visits to their farms. One day they decided, why don't we do this, and they began their journey into farming. They jumped in with the goal of growing the food that they wanted to eat. This meant that they would raise the right animals, the right way - incorporating holistic livestock care, permaculture practices, and sustainable organic farming.

Now they are a few years into their farming adventure. The farm is slowly growing and expanding it's education outreach a long the way. They actively support heritage breed livestock and education via outreach and their on-farm internship program. Both Cathy and her husband feel better than they have ever felt in their life due a combination of lifestyle and nutrient-dense food. They continue to learn along the way and they are making a difference. Keep in mind that they started all of this as virgin farmers.

Key Takeaways from this Episode:
-Start small, observe, then decide if it is worthwhile to scale up.This could be applied to livestock or a commercial crop. It is easier and less risky to make small incremental changes.
-Choose livestock breeds that match your climate and farming style.
-Do not underestimate the importance of data collection on the farm. The data ultimately drives the direction of your breeding program and the farm.
-Breed to suit your environment. Each generation ultimately can improve the genetics for your location since you can selectively breed for the traits that you favor.
-Don't forget value adds. Such as raising wool sheep where you can sell the fleece in addition to the meat.

Show Notes: http://www.permaculturevoices.com/10

Joey D'Elia joins me in this episode to talk about why people are afraid of embracing the order that comes in the "disorder of nature." We also ask why should anyone even care about food forests. Along the way we touch on embracing the "messiness" of permaculture and the importance of over-stacking the system with pioneer species early on.  This saves time and adds resiliency.

Are people afraid of order? I know I can be. I tend to think in terms of straight lines and right angles, so embracing a swervy, zig zaggy permaculture system can be hard for me. I am sure other people encounter this as well. So how can a straight line thinker adapt to a permaculture system that wants to have the system follow nature's not so straight lines.

The messiness of permaculture. Geoff Lawton has talked about this. In the beginning a lot of permaculture systems look messy. That can be hard for people to accept. Yet, that is the way that nature systems evolve. They aren't clean and tidy.Again, this is another challenge that some people have to overcome.

Visit http://www.permaculturevoices.com/9 for show notes.

Paul Greive of Primal Pastures joins me to talk about being a grass farming entrepreneur. He talks about how the thought of Primal Pastures went from an idea to a reality one weekend while sitting around with his in-laws. This small step was the catalyst that helped develop Primal Pastures into a thriving beyond-sustainable meat business. Today they are continuing to grow the farm, their community, and the soil, but this isn't without its challenges. Paul discusses these challenges, and successes that he encounters on a daily basis as new farmer entrepreneur. He stresses the importance of connecting with your customer via Social Media, the advantages to starting out in the pastured poultry business, and the big advantages of leasing land over purchasing it.

Episode Takeaways:

-Don't undervalue and underestimate the value of connecting with your customers.
-Stop focusing on the why it won't work, and go out and actually do something.
-You can establish a profitable sustainable agriculture business with a small amount of land and a small amount of initial seed capital.
-Learn as you go and learn from your mistakes.
-Take advantage of direct marketing.Sell product and take payment online and deliver to drop points.
-Looking into leasing land instead of buying it. It is much cheaper, so it it opens up a lot of land that was previously unattainable. Provide utility to the land owner.

Visit www.permaculturevoices.com/8 for show notes.

Sarah Aubrey of Prosperity Consulting joins me to talk about being an entrepreneur, starting a business, and her journey. Like many entrepreneurs she started her "career" in the corporate world and quickly realized that life wasn't for her. So she took her skills from the corporate world and applied them to a business that she could stand behind.

Takeaways from this episode:

• When you start down the road of forming a business do a lot of research on why a business would or would not work, the costs involved, the benefits to the customer, the risks involved. Most people don't do enough front end research.
• Be unique and differentiate yourself from your competition.

Visit http://www.permaculturevoices.com/7 for show notes.  H

Want to be a farmer? Always dreamed about having your own farm? Lessons from a family farmer who has gone from grassroots to prosperity in 8 years. If you are young and thinking about starting your own farm, then this podcast is a must listen.

P.S. It wasn’t easy and required A LOT of hard work and sacrifices, but it was done. And that means that you can do it too.

Adam Klaus of Bella Farm joins me in this episode to talk about his journey into the small farm business. Learn how he bought an abandoned apple orchard with his wife at age 25, and in 8 years they have turned 12 acres into a thriving small family farm that raises dairy cattle, a market garden, chickens, and multiple tree crops.

Adam definitely brings it in this episode. It is absolutely jammed with knowledge and tidbits that you can use to improve your existing farm or plan your journey into the world of small farming. He keeps it real, and he might shatter some people’s romanticized views of farming with his emphasis on how much work it will require and the possibility of a big change in lifestyle. But he might also motivate some people to change their lives. It is hard to not feel the happiness when he talks about his farm and his lifestyle. I think that a lot of people will listen to this and think “I don’t talk about my job that way. What he is doing sounds pretty awesome. I want to live more like that.” And we all can by just focusing more on really matters the most to each of us.

At the heart of Adam’s story is the biggest benefit of running a small family farm, his family and going through life with them. He is a living a life that he wants to live, working his land with his wife and kids, and to him that is what being rich is all about.
Adam talks about what worked and what didn’t work along the way; and he doesn’t sugar coat it. He will get people thinking. His story is educational and inspiring, and it proof that if you have a plan and put a lot of hard work and thinking behind it, then you can succeed at farming.

If you enjoy this podcast with Adam, you can see more of him next year at the Permaculture Voices Conference. Adam will be giving two talks, one on small farm dairy and one on biodynamic farming.

Visit http://www.permaculturevoices.com/6 for show notes.

'Building a better world, one permaculture brick at a time.'

The full and complete audio from Paul Wheaton's standing ovation keynote presentation at the Southern California Permaculture Convergence on March 9, 2013 in San Diego, CA.

"Most folks that want change tell a dozen people how bad people should stop being bad.  Over a ten year span of time, they may have told 100 people about which bad people to be angry at.

I believe that conflict come from difference of knowledge set.

I play the long game:  hundreds of tidbits of knowledge spread out over many years

If I say “permaculture” after each tidbit, then eventually a person might think “I keep hearing this word associated with cool things” and then search for more permaculture stuff on their own.

This is my strategy for world domination." Paul Wheaton

Paul presents 72 different permaculture based strategies for changing the world.  Some of these strategies are big and some are small.  Some can be done very quickly, some will require a significant amount of time.  Odds are that some of the permaculture strategies will resonate with everyone.  If each person just does a few of them, then we are all changing the world.  "Rather than being angry at bad guys, I want to share a thousand bricks for building a better world." Paul Wheaton

Visit http://www.permaculturevoices.com/5 for show notes. 

How do we get more food forests into suburban yards? We can start by planting a legume anytime that plant a fruit tree.

Then what?

Joey D'Elia joins me in this episode to discuss just that. How can people start down the path of building their own food forest in their suburban backyard.

What are some easy ways to identify trees that will work in your system?

How to not get caught up in the design phase forever and start planting now.

This will be the first episode in a multi-part series about permaculture food forests. In this episode of the podcast we ask - If food forests are the coolest thing in permaculture, why aren't there more of them? And what strategies could anyone do to start planning their food forest today.

Visit http://www.permaculturevoices.com/4 for show notes.

In this episode of the Permaculture Voices Podcast I have my friend Ben Kotnik of Suburban Food Farm on the show to talk about the recent presentation that he gave to a local permaculture group, 12 Months of Fresh Fruit. The first part of the presentation highlights some of the varieties that can be grown in Southern California to achieve the goal of a year round fruit harvest. While the varieties that we talk about are specific to SoCal, the theory behind how why the varieties were selected can be applied to any location. The second half of the presentation focuses on different techniques that can be used to grow more varieties of fruit in a given space. And these techniques can be applied anywhere in the world.

In this episode you will learn about:

• A variety of 13 fruits that could be grown in Southern California giving you 12 months of free fruit. The trees are specific to SoCal, but the theory is applicable anywhere.
• Ben’s favorite sweet citrus varieties.
• The beauty of the forgotten fruit, the white sapote. And why everyone should be growing it in SoCal.
• Why you should remove some of the fruit from a tree in the early years.
• Techniques for growing more fruit in a space.
• How to use dwarfing rootstocks to your advantage. -Why to prune and train your trees.
• Grafting several varieties onto one tree, multi-graft trees.
• Working with neighbors to grow more trees.

For Show Notes Visit: http://www.permaculturevoices.com/3

In this episode of the podcast I am happy to welcome Brandon Williams from Iron Edison battery company to talk about long lived nickel-iron batteries and why they are so much better than the more common lead acid batteries for off grid home power applications.  These types of batters are applicable to preppers, the average home owner, and permies who have remote homesteads or need mobile power sources.

In this episode you will learn about:

• How batteries fit into permaculture design.
• The history of nickel-iron batteries.
• The science behind nickel-iron batteries.
• General maintenance for battery systems.
• Advantages of nickel-iron over lead acid batteries - long lived, less toxic, wider temperature range of operation, greater depth of discharge.
• ROI of nickel-iron vs. lead acid.
• How the average suburban household can benefit from a battery backup system.
• Solar panel and battery system integration.
• Mobile power applications.
• The difference between mobile batteries and stationary batteries.

Visit http://www.permaculturevoices.com/2 for show notes. 

Gasification and Wood Gas: How to Grow Your Own Energy and Get Off the Grid

Our very first episode!

In this podcast we focused on the topics of gasification and wood gas. Local experts Troy Martz and Jared Pisell of OffGridPro.com joined us to talk about their company Off Grid Pro and the line of gasifiers that they are rolling out, the future of wood gas, how gasification fits into a permie or prepper's plan, and why you should never build a fema gasifier.

For Show Notes Visit: http://www.permaculturevoices.com/1